People are frustrated because Facebook turned red and they couldn't do anything to stop it. Because it seems inevitable at this point that DOMA will fall and that marriage equality will be legal and that people will be free to love whomever the choose. And this freaks people out. A lot. Like, way more than it should, in my opinion. "all I want," they say, "is an open, loving dialogue about the issue so we can at least understand where we are coming from." I don't know if that's true, or if people who support "traditional" marriage just want to talk more so that people might change their minds. But, I'll give it a chance. So here it is, some thoughts from the other side, proving both that I totally get where you're coming from, and that conversation is possible, if you're willing to open you're mind to the other side also.
Religious liberty.
I keep hearing all about how the crazy liberals are trampling all over religious liberty. When we let people decide if they want to take birth control or not, when we let people decide what religion they want to be a part of, when we let people decide who they want to spend the rest of their lives with, it all seems to trample all over religious liberty. Religious liberty does not mean that one religion controls all the people. It means that people are free to practice or not practice any religion or no religion.
That being said, churches are protected by the state. They are protected from being forced to do things that go against their beliefs. Masques are not forced to have pig roasts, Temples are not forced to get rid of their kosher kitchens, Churches are not forced to take field trips to strip clubs. In much the same way, no church will be forced to marry anybody that they see as un-fit to marry, including same-sex couples. But more than just same-sex couples, any clergy person or church can deny anybody the right to marry within their church. Churches do it all the time, if you have been divorced but not annulled lots of Catholic churches will not let you marry until you get an annulment. Churches are also not forced to recognize divorce as a thing, since divorce is a sin in many religions, churches are free to teach their congregation that you can not get a divorce. But divorce still remains legal, because other people who are not of that religion can get a divorce. (where are all the protests and attempts to make divorce illegal?). A clergy person that tells you that if gay marriage is legal, he or she will soon be forced to marry gays or be subject to legal action is either uneducated or lying.
But some places totally are subject to legal action for discriminating against the gays! Yes, yes they are. Those places are not churches. Those places are publicly funded places like schools. And yes, sometimes private companies, but that is a legal gray area. Churches are not a legal gray area from this, churches are free to practice their religion as they see fit. Your church will be free to deny marriages to anybody, people who just aren't ready, people who are black, people who are too young, people who are gay, etc. Heck your religion could make a rule saying straight people can't get married there, and that would be totally within your legal protections.
Sure, it's scary to not be able to control other people. Especially when you think those people are going to die a fiery death. But Jesus didn't do very much controlling. Besides, if your religion really is The Truth, don't you think people will find their way there eventually? And more so if they are not being forced?
So yes, if by religious liberty you mean that your religion will not be allowed to control other people then you are 100% right, your religious liberty is being trampled on. But if by religious liberty you mean everyone has the right to practice whatever religion they choose, then no, not so much. And one other thought, be careful with the idea that we can invalidate a religion, because once the state has control over what OTHER religions can do...that's when they will start being able to control what your religion can do.
Is it a sin?
There are two very different debates happening over this issue. One is whether or not is is legal for gay people to get married, or rather is it unconstitutional to forbid them to marry (we will get to that later), and the other is whether or not being gay is a sin. The question of whether or not being gay is a sin is directly related to whether or not gay people get married in your church, but not so related to the legal question of marriage equality.
There a million arguments on why being gay, or at least being in a gay relationship, is a sin. All of these arguments seem to boil down to two basic concepts: pro-creation and gender roles. And you have probably heard all the opposing arguments against it which are basically that gender is pretty much made up and the world is over crowded and love can't really be controlled by those rules. This can be argued all day and all night. You don't have to change your opinion on the matter, just as long as you don't impose that opinion on anybody else. It's also a pretty interesting conversation to have, assuming everyone goes into it with an open mind. But none of that has anything to do with the legal question of marriage equality. Because as was pointed out above, one religion's sins can not dictate another person's life.
And no, by legalizing gay marriage liberals are not imposing their views on you, because you are free to continue in your life as it was before.
This discussion is for another blog at another time.
Slippery Slope.
But if we let the gays get married then who knows what else will be legal! Proven simply by the fact that when they de-criminalized sodomy in Texas a dissenting justice said it will soon lead to the legalization of gay marriage...and here we are. The idea of legalizing gay marriage is about letting two consenting adults marry, because they are adults and they are able to make their own choices. Some things that can't make their own choices are: kitchen appliances, animals, inanimate objects that are not people. To argue that gay marriage will lead to the marriage of anyone to anything is just silly. Besides, if we let people marry toasters, soon we will let toasters marry each other and then..seriously, what will this country have come to.
The slippery slope toward polygamy is a little more reasonable. I don't have a crystal ball so I can't say if polygamy will go back to being the norm for marriage as it was in the Bible, but this doesn't much have to do with gay people. Who knows, if the FLDS church starts a huge civil rights movement and becomes some kind of force in America that out battles the 99% of everyone else who don't want polygamous marriages, then maybe. But lets just go ahead and cross that bridge when we get there, and acknowledge that polygamy is probably not going to be legal for a while. (currently polygamy is a CRIME, and something being illegal is very different from something not being legal).
But none of that is the real fear. So I'm going to go ahead and address the real fear: if those stinkin' libs get this gay marriage thing, they won't stop there, they will just keep fighting for other weird stuff. Yes, yes that's true. You really want people to just say, "hey thanks for making things equal here on this marriage deal, we will just go ahead and ignore all the other inequalities of the world now"? Nope. More than polygamy you should be worried that if this gay marriage thing happens those stinkin' libs will turn their attention to things like trans-rights, women's rights, or animal rights. (get to know a one of them and you will find this to be true). So if you want to have the slippery slope argument, lets have a rational one. If gay marriage becomes legal, homosexuality will be normalized, kids will learn about gay leaders in school, trans* people will start having rights like the ability to change the gender on their birth certificate, transgender issues might become normalized, women will get equal pay, women will start being treated like people, etc. (Not in that order). But the thing about the slippery slope is this: if you have an issue with one of the things on the list, but not gay marriage...stop fighting gay marriage and start fighting the thing you have a problem with. Except that, again, your religion doesn't really get to dictate other people. Sooo...I don't know what to tell you. Maybe try acceptance.
Legality.
So the LEGAL question of gay marriage becomes simple: does anybody have a constitutional right to stop gay people from getting married? Do gay people have a constitutional right to marriage? That's it. Because all that other stuff just has to do with human interactions, religion, morality, etc, not so much law.
The constitution has two amendments that pretty much decide the case. The fifth amendment which says "No person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property with out due process". This doesn't mean that the supreme court HAS to legalize it, but they at least have to hear the cases before they deprive gay people of the liberty to marry.
And the fourteenth amendment, which says, "No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty or property without due process of law; nor deny any person within it's jurisdiction equal protection of the laws."
No, marriage equality is not already established because every person has the right to marry someone of the opposite sex. I think we can all agree that's an empty argument. Gay couples are denied over 1100 rights that straight couples have, that is the definition of inequality. To me the legal argument seems pretty simple, and maybe that's what worries people.
As it turns out, "it makes me uncomfortable" is not grounds to make something illegal. If it were, car shopping would be illegal, going to the club would be illegal, being kissed on the cheek by Aunt Betty who you haven't seen in three years would be illegal. You catch my drift.
Purpose.
Considering all of this, I have to wonder what the purpose of keeping marriage an institution of inequality is for conservatives. If your hope is to have more straight couples, the legality of gay marriage will not affect the number or gay or straight couples in the world. It will only affect how much protection under the law these couples get.
The sin argument, even if it were based in legality, doesn't make any sense here either. We are not arguing about if gay people should build lives together, have children, and get old and senile. That's already happening and will keep happening. We are arguing about if said gay couples should be entitled to receive the life insurance of the person they spent the last 40 years with when that person dies.
It seems like your purpose is to have the country living your morality, which not only has no legal basis, but is pretty rude and unconstitutional.
Extra thoughts
+Liberals, progressives or whatever label you want to place are not perfect. Lots of people are not accepting of things they should be accepting of, conservatives and liberals alike. This, though, is not pertinent to the legality of equality.
+Yes, I should accept everyone. No, I should not accept your intolerance of others.
+If you are uncomfortable with gay people, don't hang out with them. Problem solved.
